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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: July 2nd, 2015, 7:19 pm 
Gondorian
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Meneldilme wrote:
Isn't the difference here is that for *þindar* you're using the adjective as a noun, and therefore it forms it's plural as a noun.

Yeah, I'd say so. Though we do see Sindar Eldar c. 1951 in Common Eldarin: Noun Structure, contemporary with the later Tengwesta Qenderinwa 2 (PE18), Outline of Phonology (PE19), and Verb Structure (PE22). However, in his August 1952 recording of Namárie (the one with inyar), we already see plural ilye and linte, which also show up in a somewhat-earlier version still having -n for genitive and not -o (Stage II.A in Tyalië Tyelelliéva 12). We then see that in Stage II.B (pretty much the same version, but now with -o genitive and a few other small changes).

As far as dating goes, the c. 1951 Noun Structure with Sindar Eldar also has genitive -n, partitive , which had already appeared in earlier documents. I suppose it's possible that Stage II.B of Namárie was composed after that (with -a adjectives in -e) ... or it could just be Tolkien bouncing around different possibilities. Dating it too precisely probably isn't that feasible, though perhaps I'm getting a bit technical.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: July 9th, 2015, 9:27 am 
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I am in awe of your knowledge, Tyrhael. I general, I'm impressed by people who try to get into Sindarin : )

I didn't know that Tolkien used þ for writing Quenya too - I think I might adopt it too.
I'm reading through the icelandic sagas at the moment, though on a short break during this vacation, and I think that if you'd want a text that could be translated with few neologisms they might be a good fit. Lots of stuff about warriors and ships and kings, and so far mostly divided into smaller sections. Obviously I'm not skilled enough at all yet, but eventually I'd like to try my hand at a small section to see if my hypothesis is correct.

At the moment I'm just translating various bits and pieces both ways (other peoples quenya constructions, sentences/parts of texts, sometimes the silm if the mood strikes) which I guess helps with vocabulary and such. It's a bit harder to get your regular practice when there are no longer ready-made problems from your course, but I'm still trying : )


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: July 10th, 2015, 11:19 am 
Warden of the Knight
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I have a question about wuenya, not so much on grammar but on another side subject.

It being an actual language is it copywriten or could someone use it in a book? For example, you guys are talking about translating into quenya (which I think is really cool). If someone translated a book of poetry into quenya could they publish that book (assuming they had rights to the poetry) and sell it?

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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: July 10th, 2015, 4:02 pm 
Gondorian
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Carl Hostetter talks about the issue of copyright here (near the bottom of the page).

http://www.elvish.org/FAQ.html

Now maybe some disagree with that, I don't know. Carl Hostetter notes that he is not a lawyer, and I certainly am not, but anyway, I was aware of this section of his FAQ.

It's about certain aspects of copyright issues anyway :)


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: July 10th, 2015, 5:28 pm 
Warden of the Knight
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Cool, thanks! I didnt know that the issue would even have been addessed already somewhere. I will read through it.

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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 19th, 2017, 2:40 pm 
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Aiya!

Not sure if anyone saw it, but recently I've found the newest (?) revised course of Helge aka Ardalambion website. Although it's not in pdf and there are some strange font changes though out it, I think it's very useful. :)

http://elfling.midgardsmal.com/index.ph ... 967.0.html You can find it here. And one advice. If you want to download it, DO NOT press the link. Copy it into the browser without the first http:// cause there are two of them.

Hope it helps :)


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 19th, 2017, 3:23 pm 
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Thanks for sharing! I'm afraid my "studies" of the language have been sorely neglected but I certainly still have an interest in it. If only life offered more time in my day! :P

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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 19th, 2017, 5:45 pm 
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Camilla The Wanderer wrote:
Aiya!

Not sure if anyone saw it, but recently I've found the newest (?) revised course of Helge aka Ardalambion website. Although it's not in pdf and there are some strange font changes though out it, I think it's very useful. :)

http://elfling.midgardsmal.com/index.ph ... 967.0.html You can find it here. And one advice. If you want to download it, DO NOT press the link. Copy it into the browser without the first http:// cause there are two of them.

Hope it helps :)


Thanks! (I feel like as a group quenya learners owe Helge an awful lot...)
I'm working on a transcription of the line of the Númenoran kings (as found in... unfinished or lost tales, can't remember which one) into tengwar. I'm just taking the danish text in my book and using a danish tengwar modus (from http://www.tengwar.dk/) because I can't be bothered to translate the whole thing into quenya... But I got a really nice notebook for that purpose, and once I'm done with this project I'll have plenty of pages left over for quenya tengwar text. Maybe I'll get back around to some poetry.
Will upload pictures later.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 19th, 2017, 5:54 pm 
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Not a problem at all! Glad to share it with fellow Quenya students :)

And good luck with your work! Can't wait to see the pictures :)


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 19th, 2017, 11:20 pm 
Warden of the Knight
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Look forward to seeing some pictures too!

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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 20th, 2017, 4:41 pm 
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Cover:
Image
Quick flip-through (just pause it if you need a longer look?):
[YouTube] https://youtu.be/Orgcwi5NCWQ [/YouTube]
Mistakes are mostly stuff like adding/forgetting a tengwar because I read something wrong... Or forgetting that numerals existed for the first two pages. On the last page you can see that there are some corrective footnotes, and that I haven't yet added the vowels.
I'm up to the 5th king, so there's plenty left to do.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 20th, 2017, 4:45 pm 
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That looks really nice :) I wish I knew how to write Tengwar

I like you're notebook, though ;o


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 20th, 2017, 5:21 pm 
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Camilla The Wanderer wrote:
That looks really nice :) I wish I knew how to write Tengwar

I like you're notebook, though ;o


It's from Paperblanks!!! That brand makes notebooks in different sizes that are just SO beautiful and elfish. I spent like 30 minutes in the store agonizing over which one to choose when I bought mine. Look at this and tell me it isn't the kind of book Maglor would use for poetry... I was also really tempted by this. Really recommended if you want to feel like a noldor scribe. Here in Denmark, Bog & Ide carry them. IDK about other places.
And tbh I find that I barely need to look up the letters now when I transcribe into tengwar. Switching between quenya/english/danish mode is kind of hard, though.


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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 20th, 2017, 5:58 pm 
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Curufine wrote:
Cover:
Image
Quick flip-through (just pause it if you need a longer look?):

Mistakes are mostly stuff like adding/forgetting a tengwar because I read something wrong... Or forgetting that numerals existed for the first two pages. On the last page you can see that there are some corrective footnotes, and that I haven't yet added the vowels.
I'm up to the 5th king, so there's plenty left to do.

Wow! That is really awesome! And to think the library of Imladris would be filled with such books....
Makes me want to get back into it even more now. Thanks for sharing Curufine!

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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 20th, 2017, 6:30 pm 
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I whole heartedly concure! That is some realy neat stuff! How long did all that take you?

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 Post subject: Re: Let's Appreciate Quenya - Resources and help for courses
PostPosted: February 21st, 2017, 3:28 am 
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Curufine wrote:
Camilla The Wanderer wrote:
That looks really nice :) I wish I knew how to write Tengwar

I like you're notebook, though ;o


It's from Paperblanks!!! That brand makes notebooks in different sizes that are just SO beautiful and elfish. I spent like 30 minutes in the store agonizing over which one to choose when I bought mine. Look at this and tell me it isn't the kind of book Maglor would use for poetry... I was also really tempted by this. Really recommended if you want to feel like a noldor scribe. Here in Denmark, Bog & Ide carry them. IDK about other places.
And tbh I find that I barely need to look up the letters now when I transcribe into tengwar. Switching between quenya/english/danish mode is kind of hard, though.



They all look so amazing o.o And yea, they do look like elvish.
Maybe someday I'll get one of those for Tewgwar ;o
Really? That's awesome. And I bet that it's a bit hard to switch. I can't imagine myself doing what you do right now o.o
But all in all, it really looks amazing


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