Eärendil, for one, and Tuor (though he was later counted among the Elder Children).

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Yeah okay, but that was in the first age and they didn't really have the chance to prove the existence of the Valar to the people who were not aware of their existence.
It's not easy to believe in someone you have never seen and of whom it isn't clear if they do something to your advantage. Sauron destroyed things, so it was easy to workship him if it stopped him from destroying things, the Valar didn't do anything to stop him themselves, they just let things happen. I guess many would have a hard time workshipping gods who obviously don't do a thing to help them.

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Brynhild, 'mail coat of battle'

In the sheltering shade of the forest
Calling, calming silence
Accompanied only by the full moon
The howling of the Night Wolf
And the path under my bare feet...
...the Elvenpath

Yeah, that does make sense.

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Virtually all the beings of Middle-earth have heard of the Valar.
Frodo for instance has heard of Melkor and the creation of the Orcs as he tells it to Sam on the pass above Morgul. Sam knows about the Silmarils and Earendil.
The Hobbits knew alot of tales about the Ancient days but there trouble was they had difficulties in believing in them becuase of there comfortable little lives.
The Rangers of Ithilien know about the Valar as well as we see in the Book.

The only time I can recall that People worshipped Eru was on Meneltarma in Westernesse.

Well, Frodo and Sam are odd cases--they both spent lots of time with Bilbo, who spent lots of time with the Elves. I think they're fairly poor examples for that, since we have no way of knowing if their knowledge is standard for hobbits or not.

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True, however we know from LOTR that Hobbits have heard of 'Other shores', when they speak we hear them mentioning the Elves setting sail to other shores. I would say they at least know of Valinor, but whether they believe it or not is another matter.

Good point, LoA--I had forgotten that. That would kind of prove that your idea is correct.

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As for Eru though I am not sure. We can assume that all beings at least know of Eru but it appears they simply find him too remote to think or talk about.
I say this mainly becuase all the books of Lore in Middle-earth originate from the books of Lore written by the Elves in ancient times and thus are likely to include much of what is said there. For instance The Silmarillion is an account of how the Eldar saw the world and what they were told by the Valar. And The Silmarillion was available to Frodo and Bilbo and thus must be where and why Frodo knew of the origins of Orc. Thus he must also know of Iluvatar.

The Silmarillion was available to Frodo and Bilbo?

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It was the book used by Bilbo, no doubt given to him by the Elves of Rivendell. Remember just like 'The Hobbit' is a book written by Bilbo (also called 'There and Back Again', The Silmarillion was written by the Elves. I cannot find the quote at present (its somewhere buried in one of 15 books).

Right. Well, I'll believe you this time, though I have a feeling that quote wasn't in any of the books I read (though I've only read BoLT from HOME).

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It may be in the letters. It is not in any of the usual books. HOME or letters most likely. If I come across it again I will post it here.

Okay, thanks, LoA.

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Hi everyone,

Not to intrude in the discussion or anything ... just wondering about the origin of 'The Silmarillion':



I always thought that 'The Silmarillion' was written BY Bilbo THROUGH his research in Rivendell. Infact, I read somewhere, I think it was Christopher Tolkien, saying that the books that Bilbo gave to Frodo after the destruction of the ring ('On Elvish Translations' ... or something like that) was infact 'The Silmarillion'.

Not sure about this - but I just wanted to add what I thought had been the case. I will try and find where I read it.

Thanks.

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Perhaps so. All I remember is seeing a quote which involed The Silmarillion, Frodo and Bilbo all within a few words of eachother.

Thats an idea that has crossed my mind once or twice, Eärendil, but it's never stuck for long, for some reason. It's a pretty good idea, too. It would make sense for Bilbo to have written The Silmarillion while he was staying in Rivendell, in the same way that Frodo 'wrote' LotR. Of course, though, there are things mentioned in LotR that I don't think Frodo would have known, though I might be confusing a part with something written specifically from Tolkien's perspective.

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