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PostPosted: February 6th, 2010, 12:01 am 
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^ And that, it would seem is the tragedy.

It's kinda like coming away from ROTK an emotional weeping wreck, and then you realise aside from the battles the characters were weak and the story was non-existant.

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PostPosted: February 6th, 2010, 12:22 am 
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That's kind of how I feel about the movie. I didn't hate it as it is, but I my thinking is, if you were going to go through all the trouble of developing this new technology and spending all this money, why not make it a really good movie that actually touches people? I mean, would it kill James Cameron to hire a decent screenwriter when he can't think of a better plot or dialogue? :confused:
I really think that if it wasn't **James Cameron!** who made this film, it wouldn't be doing nearly as well, especially in the awards.

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PostPosted: February 6th, 2010, 6:12 am 
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Lady Dark Moon wrote:
No one's making you go. I do see your point, though, that Avatar doesn't deserve that many nominations. I also hope it doesn't win stuff like Best Motion Picture of the Year because it wasn't. Art Direction and Visual Effects, maybe, but definitely not Music either.

The thing with Avatar is that it's a completely submersive experience. You walk out of the theater dazed and seeing blue men everywhere you go, but an hour later you start asking yourself about plot and worldbuilding. Cameron has remarkable talent, but had he put more effort into storyline Avatar would have been leagues beyond amazing.


No-one is pointing a gun to my head and forcing me to go. True.
But the whole 'zomgz you must go see it or else you're a hater' vibe I get doesn't endear me to the movie at all. In all likelyhood when it's out on dvd, my 'hubby' will want to buy it so I'll probably see it then if I feel like it.

I'm a huge detractor of 3D cinema. It never appealed to me way back when and it still doesn't now. I don't care how pretty Pandora looks, if I'm not drawn in to the story no amount of money spent on the CG will make a lick of difference.

The whole thing makes me angry, sad and disapointed. With the exception of one movie, I love Cameron's work. IMO Terminator 2 is an absolute masterpiece but because it's an action movie and has Arnie in it, it's not taken seriously. T2 pushed the boundaries of CGI at the time, but it also had a compelling story to back it all up.

Just my opinion. I'm obviously in the minority considering how many weeks Avatar has spent at the #1 in the box office and how much money it's made/records it's broken ect. So my little voice doesn't really mean a whole lot.

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PostPosted: February 6th, 2010, 8:14 pm 
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So I saw it today and here's what I thought.

I know everyone has said it but Pandora is really beautiful. Unfortunately the reality checker in my head kept saying it was implausible for the entire planet to be all foresty but I told it to SHUT UP! The fauna and flora (yes, I'm being nerdy) really showed up and was just excellent detail. As well the climatic battle and the part where the dozers approached. Especially in 3D, you felt every explosion and arrow and all sort of chaotic images. Very well done, visually.

Story-wise...ehh kinda cliche. I was rather annoyed that the Na'vi culture was supposed to be really alien but I look at it and think "Eh, it can happen on Earth". And I really didn't care about them. And really. James Cameron doesn't have any excuse. With powerful visual effects, you should use them to immerse us in their culture. The whole plot seemed odd: "We're here. We want to get there. They're there. They won't leave. They've attacked us in the past. We should try to work out a deal or kill them all." Yeahh, show us when they've attacked you guys. I mean the Na'vi reacted to the random technology the humans brought with "Oh, okay, I'm just going to mind my business...oh *beep* did it just bring down my trees?" You're seriously not telling me the Na'vi found some sort of curiosity with the humans? And the animals. Okay, I know you're trying to establish a link between reality and your little world, Cameron, but really. Yes, adding more legs to a horse does make it look weird but it doesn't make it look alien. You want an idea, read the Amber Spyglass by Philip Pullman. Granted, they were using an alternate universe but I'm pretty sure the animals in another planet would evolve different than the the quadrupedal form we see. Okay, the Na'vi MAY be forgiven because Cameron was also writing a love story so whatever.

And the characters. GOOD. *beep*ing! GOD! I felt NOTHING (except hatred, see below) for almost the entire cast. Not even the Na'vi. The only people I liked was Trudy and Nom and maybe Grace and they had to freakin' kill Trudy and Grace off. They had the Mr. "Let's blow everything up and kill everyone 'cause I get off on it" Colonel and his inability to die until his karmic death. The Mr. "I want to make money off from this planet and I don't care about my actions since I'm going to be swimming in a pool of money" Businessman. And my least favourite of all, the Mr. "My sole personality is the BA soldier so I don't need things like emotions" Marine. God, I hated Jake. His narrating SUCKS. He's not Liam Neeson, Jackie Earle Haley, or Morgan freakin' Freeman. He has a boring little voice that possess no inflection or sense of emotion whatsoever and I didn't want to HEAR HIM! The Na'vi were worse. As already mentioned about the culture, they just seemed too perfect! I mean the only person who actively opposed Jake was that one chief lieutenant and everyone else supposedly gave up their free will. And they made the chief lieutenant seem like a jerk a little too much. And it got annoying. Fast. The only sole piece of redemption for the Na'vi when it was the native girl who killed the colonel. NOT Jake. Finally. Someone who doesn't suffer from the dumbass in distress syndrome.

Overall, Avatar is much like that pretty blonde you meet in a club or a pub. She has all the looks and she'll certainly appeal to some immature desire in your head, but once you get to talk to her, you'll find her terribly boring and severely lacking in personality. Was it good? Yes. Was it worth the $13.25 I had to pay for it? Well, considering I paid only 75 cents more to go to the medieval fair, I'll say no.

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PostPosted: February 6th, 2010, 8:18 pm 
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One thing that you sort of touched on was something I also disliked about Avatar. The good guys had no flaws and the bad guys had no redeeming qualities. The movie was completely black and white.

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PostPosted: February 6th, 2010, 8:26 pm 
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Oh my god, YES!

They're like freakin' Elves. IN SPACE! And even the elves had flaws! Seriously, this is why I liked the human characters more than the Na'vi and only those. Take Trudy. Trudy started out joining the military for god knows why, she's not in the main cast so who gives a toss about her. Then she sees what the military really has planned for them and she has a change of heart. While feeling rushed, it was certainly believable.

So some people will undoubtedly bother me and say "Why did you like District 9 and not Avatar?" Well for a couple reasons. One. JAKE WASN'T IN DISTRICT 9!!! Two. The prawns were by no stretch perfect. They attacked the trains and probably assaulted some of the humans. They were very very much flawed. So when you put them with the humans though, you kinda went for the prawns. James Cameron pretty much pushed and shoved you to the Na'vi.

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PostPosted: February 6th, 2010, 11:14 pm 
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Good grief Caunion, I thought I was the only one. It's not even the plot or the dialogue that gets me. The worldbuilding freaking kills me. The entire time I was like "six-legged horses, Indian war cries, really?" If you're going to take us to an alien world, TAKE US TO AN ALIEN WORLD. What's up with the blue Lothlorien and the freaking flying things? What even is the evolutionary advantage of being blue? Most of the plants were green. Pandora is a worldbuilding nightmare.

I did like the floating mountains. Very pretty. Kind of original too. And hah my favorite character was Mr. Businessman. He cracked me up.

The plot was okay. Familiar and simple, but it worked... except for the deus ex machina at the end. Facepalm facepalm facepalm.

Anyhoo, my point with the Avatar bashing was objective. I view directors as artists, and with any book or movie you have to experience it first before judging its artistic merit. It sounds like you're taking others' opinions and claiming them as your own instead of judging for yourself. I know people who do love Avatar for its storyline, dialogue, and characters, so I don't know where you got your 99.9% from.

Again, not saying you should see it. In fact with your 3D discomforts you probably shouldn't :P. You should just see it before you criticize it.

Raivynn Phoenix wrote:
No-one is pointing a gun to my head and forcing me to go. True.
But the whole 'zomgz you must go see it or else you're a hater' vibe I get doesn't endear me to the movie at all. In all likelyhood when it's out on dvd, my 'hubby' will want to buy it so I'll probably see it then if I feel like it.


I don't recommend watching it on DVD unless you'd like to catch up on sleep.

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PostPosted: February 7th, 2010, 4:46 am 
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*applauds Caunion*
Very nice review, thorough, detailed and informed - also well-written to the point of entertaining. :P

And by the way, I loved Grace for being a redhead and a smoker - and for being Sigourney Weaver, of course! :teehee:

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PostPosted: February 7th, 2010, 6:52 am 
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I kind feel like I'm going round in circles here lol
I won't speak for anyone else but me...but I am in no way taking anyone else's opinion as my own. My own issues with Avatar are my own and mine alone. Are other people judging on what other people tell them? Probably, such is life. But I'm not one of them.

I had very high hopes about this movie. I'm generally a fan of Cameron's work and was looking forward to Avatar. I followed the movie as a W.I.P and was on board till I saw pics, trailers and read info about the movie. NOT reviews...actual information and facts. I took it all on board and decided the movie wasn't for me.

I applaud the people who put the hard work into making the movie [ie/ WETA]. I haven't dissed them at all. The final product just did not appeal to me that's all. I don't see how that's insulting, it's just a matter of opinion which is neither right nor wrong. It's all subjective at the end of the day. I find the work on T2 or The Abyss to be much more appealing to my sensibilties.

So if I'd fall asleep during the movie on dvd, or more likely in my case blu-ray. Then that isn't a very good advertisement for the movie nor does it make me want to go see it in the cinema. I don't feel like I'm missing out on some profound experience. It's just a movie and people need to start treating it as such and not some precious life changing event.


This rant was not aimed at anyone at all. I just felt like I needed to reiterate my stance and hopefully clear a few misconceptions up about why I dislike it.

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PostPosted: February 7th, 2010, 2:00 pm 
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^I know where you stand, Raivynn, and I respect your opinion. My comment was more directed at JF's random statistic and her comparison to RotK.

Ooo, Ea, Grace was definitely love. I didn't like her in the beginning but she grew on me. I loved the Marine too, but maybe that's because I have a thing for Marines.

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