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Beren and Luthien (partly) based on Orpheus and Eurydice?
http://www.arwen-undomiel.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=16980		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Aerandir [ November 4th, 2007, 1:01 pm ]
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Sounds reasonable to me, though I only read a summarized version of Orpheus and Eurydice.

A while back ethelfleda made a topic about Tolkien and inverted fairy tales, which kind of plays into your whole observation about the similarities between the lay of Beren and Lúthien and Orpheus and Eurydice.
Author:  Aerandir [ November 5th, 2007, 10:52 am ]
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You mean, specifically between the Valar and Greek Mythology? :P Nah, never noticed a thing (that's a blatant lie, btw).

I think it would be a simple matter to change it into 'inverted myths', which still is true in quite a few cases. Lúthien actually has a lot more of the 'hero' roles in The Lay of Leithan than Beren does. Beren is pretty much the shock absorber for the two of them, taking the damage and then getting healed by Lúthien. :)
Author:  ethelfleda [ November 5th, 2007, 12:08 pm ]
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nice to see one of my previous threads getting a mention. :)

i definitely agree about the similarities between the stories of orpheus and eurydice and beren and luthien, but i think it's worth pointing out that the lay of luthien is actually closer to sir orfeo (a middle english retelling of the orpheus myth) than the greek version - in both the lay of luthien and sir orfeo the couple return together from the underworld/other world, whereas orpheus fails in his task in the greek myth. i'm sure tolkien would have known the classical version, but he would have been more familiar with sir orfeo (he wrote his own translation of it), so i would guess that that was his direct point of reference.
Author:  Aerandir [ November 5th, 2007, 1:14 pm ]
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Ah, that's a very good point, ethelfleda. I've read Tolkien's translation of Sir Orfeo, so I should've thought of that. :)

Thanks for reminding me of it.
Author:  Aerandir [ November 5th, 2007, 1:23 pm ]
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Sir Orfeo was really good. I read a copy that had it sandwiched in between Sir Gawain and the Green Knight and Pearl, both of which Tolkien translated.
Author:  Aerandir [ November 5th, 2007, 2:03 pm ]
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I don't really have any more thoughts right off of the top of my head on it--the most obvious resemblance is of the Valar and the Greek gods. Beyond that, I haven't really considered it.
Author:  mephiston, lord of death [ January 2nd, 2009, 11:05 am ]
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Aerandir wrote:
I think it would be a simple matter to change it into 'inverted myths', which still is true in quite a few cases. Lúthien actually has a lot more of the 'hero' roles in The Lay of Leithan than Beren does. Beren is pretty much the shock absorber for the two of them, taking the damage and then getting healed by Lúthien. :)

Beren was the worlds first tank? (in a WoW sense)? :P :P

*Embraces the fan hate :P*

On a different note, is Sir Gawain and the Green Knight, tolkiens translation any good?

cheers,
Mephiston
Author:  Aerandir [ January 2nd, 2009, 2:15 pm ]
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Yeah, pretty much, Mephiston. He was the Tank and she was the Healer. It's a pretty good team. :P

And I enjoyed Sir Gawain and the Green Knight as he translated it. I haven't read any other translations, though, so I don't know how it compares.
Author:  mephiston, lord of death [ January 6th, 2009, 3:53 am ]
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Aerandir wrote:
Yeah, pretty much, Mephiston. He was the Tank and she was the Healer. It's a pretty good team. :P

And I enjoyed Sir Gawain and the Green Knight as he translated it. I haven't read any other translations, though, so I don't know how it compares.

Level 70 Human Warrior, with mainly protection spec and a level 80 druid with healing spec :P

I know the sorta main plot of Sir Gawain, Im just wondering which translation to buy, because from what I understand of the tale itself, its fairly awesome, and I want to keep it that way :P

Mephiston
Author:  Aerandir [ January 6th, 2009, 11:30 pm ]
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Just buy his translation and trust it for quality. ^_^ He's proven that he does things well, after all.
Author:  DARKastheRAIN [ January 17th, 2010, 5:11 am ]
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I saw a lot of similarities between Túrin and Hercules. Of course there are more similarities between Túrin's story and Sigurd's, but as far as personality goes Túrin's a lot like Hercules.

Hercules had a bad temper and a tendancy to accidentally kill people in his fits of rage. Sound familiar? And both of them were usually really sorry about it later.
Author:  Anduril Vanlhach [ February 21st, 2011, 10:54 am ]
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Omg i never realised it before but your right!!!
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