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Did Boromir deserve to die?
http://www.arwen-undomiel.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=3648		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  Nazgulette [ November 5th, 2005, 2:28 am ]
Post subject:  Did Boromir deserve to die?
He gets murdered after trying to hurt Frodo to take the ring and he makes they movies funny. I personally think he was good and he didn't deserve to die, he was a bit "I'm the steward of Gondor and I don't need a king" concerened at the start BuT he was better at the end when he said that Aragorn was his king, he also saved Merry and Pippin and if it wasn't for them the witch king would be alive and Faramir would be dead. I cried :'( when Boromir died. Is there anyone who thinks he did deserve to die? If so why?
Author:  Eruadan [ November 5th, 2005, 1:14 pm ]
Post subject: 
I'm not saying he deserves to die, or that he's an idiot, but his death symbolizes the corruption brought on by the ring. His death served as an example of how even good-hearted men could be seduced, showing that there is no good in the ring, nor is there any chance of bending its nature. It's evil, pure and simple. Boromir dying assured that.
Author:  Raivynn Phoenix [ November 5th, 2005, 1:19 pm ]
Post subject: 
^
Excellent points. I voted no as I don't think he deserved to die. However as Eruadan said his death was very symbolic and was a very powerful sacrifice.
Author:  Herenya [ November 5th, 2005, 8:33 pm ]
Post subject: 
I don't think he deserved to die. I don't really think anyone 'deserves' to die - except Sauron, and Boromir, even if you choose to argue that he was evil, wasn't a tyranny...

I think the manner of Boromir's death sort of saved himself, though... because he was trying to save the hobbits. He was thinking about other people, and not just himself - like with his interactions with Frodo...
Author:  Arsarniel [ November 5th, 2005, 8:46 pm ]
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"Many that live deserve death. And some that die deserve life. Can you give it to them? Then do not be too eager to deal out death in judgment. For even the very wise cannot see all ends."

Who can say it better than the Professor himself? :)
Author:  vikingmaiden [ November 5th, 2005, 9:22 pm ]
Post subject: 
I wouldn't say he 'deserved' to die, but try to think of the rest of the story if Boromir hadn't died...it doesn't make as much sense somehow. So in a way, he had to give up his life. Like others have said, Boromir was redeemed through his heroic death. He realised his pride and sacrificed his life for others. I think Boromir is a trully admirable character, despite what others may say (he's arrogant, prideful, a jerk, etc.).
Author:  Larael [ November 7th, 2005, 11:58 pm ]
Post subject: 
I do not believe he deserved to die. I don't think anyone deserves to die. I think Boromir is one of the bravest characters in the book, because he sacrifices his life for the people he loves.

It's like the saying "Some who live deserve to die, and some who die deserve to live."

Or something like that...
Author:  Nienor [ November 8th, 2005, 8:08 am ]
Post subject: 
I think Vikingmaiden said it perfectly. What would have happened if he hadn't died? I think that his death may have been necessary, because though the Ring was out of his reach, he would likely still have desired it...and imagine the reaction Denethor would have if he knew that his son had lost it. Boromir and Aragorn might clash when they arrived at Minas Tirith; any number of things might have happened, really. I think that Boromir, in dying for the sake of the Hobbits, redeemed himself.
Author:  Bellethiel [ November 12th, 2005, 12:17 am ]
Post subject: 
Does anyone deserve to die? does anyone deserve to live?
Author:  Herenya [ November 12th, 2005, 3:04 am ]
Post subject: 
Bellethiel wrote:
Does anyone deserve to die? does anyone deserve to live?

I'd honestly say that none of us are in a position to really judge that... I'm not sure about the 'deserve to live' part, though. What means that you deserve to live? That you have something to offer? That your life has a purpose? - but that doesn't mean it's a productive one... hm...

In response to what vikingmaiden and Nienor said, I still would say that just because his death was probably one of the "easiest" options (I agree that he redeemed himself because he died to save the hobbits) and had he carried on, it would have become a lot more complicated, especially with the family relationships, and I'm not sure if Boromir would have had an easy time living with himself, knowing what he did to Frodo - and the same goes for the rest of the Fellowship still around, I still don't think that it means Boromir deserved to die, or should have died. Certainly he hadn't done anything to deserve any condemnation, except arouse suspision as to where his loyalties lie and how much he could be trusted.
Author:  Aemornion [ November 17th, 2005, 6:19 pm ]
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No living man deserves to die, but he died protecting his friends and that is a very honorable death.

If he had survived he would redeem himself to all who he failed (Frodo i.e.) for he saw he made a mistake out of greed that he would hardly regret it.

In my view Boromir interprets an very noble man with his ussual weakness; the fact he would do anything to protect his home nad the people he loves. All other characters didnt have so much expressed their weaknesses but he had and maybe thats why I admire him the most.
Author:  Romendacil [ November 20th, 2005, 7:24 am ]
Post subject: 
Herenya wrote:
I don't think he deserved to die. I don't really think anyone 'deserves' to die - except Sauron,


I truly have to dissagree with that. Sauron wasnt all bad, at start, and maybe he meant it, at the start of the second age, when he said he was sorry to the Valar. And he turned agaings Middle earth only because he was together with Melkor for so long, that the corroptions took his heart again. Sauron is not the root of evil. Melkor Morgoth is. perhaps he could have been saved by the valar, if they really tried to heal him from the darkness in his heart. And by the way, he truly had reason to hate us. For in the past he dealt with many serious injuries, that came from us. So its logical he was a little pissed. + those nasty guys stole his ring.

At this point I would also like to tell..that the only thing in middle earth, truly evil is the ring.

As for Boromir..again he was not evil..he didnt even turn evil for a second, when he tried to take the ring.He was corrupted. He went mad. And you dont kill a mad person. You put him away.
Author:  Eä [ November 21st, 2005, 6:02 am ]
Post subject: 
Romendacil wrote:
So its logical he was a little pissed. + those nasty guys stole his ring.
Lol
Quote:
At this point I would also like to tell..that the only thing in middle earth, truly evil is the ring.
But Sauron created the ring, he made it with the one purpose to become the Lord of the Rings.
Quote:
As for Boromir..again he was not evil..he didnt even turn evil for a second, when he tried to take the ring.He was corrupted. He went mad. And you dont kill a mad person. You put him away.

Boromir died for the plot and Tolkien killed him! :angel:
Boromir's character is there to show the unpredictably dangerous influence the ring has on people, even though their desire is to do only good, but the ring corrupts and twists every good deed and thought.
His death helped carry on the story line; The Breaking of the Fellowship, Faramir's suicide mission later on etc.
Wait, geez, I'm sounding so cynical.
Surely no one deserves death, least of all poor Boromir who just happened to follow his heart and with the love of his home in mind tried to do what he was brought up to do - protect the people of Gondor. And at that time in the book it did seem a plausible and reliable decision. It's so easy to be wise after the event when we know how it all ends!
Author:  Romendacil [ November 21st, 2005, 10:26 am ]
Post subject: 
Yes..Sauron made the ring for evil purpoce. But does that mean he is necesarily totally evil? I still think not. (Read up..there is why I think so) The ring is the one truly evil thing because its sort ofa machine, created only for evil. At the very beginning it was evil (Unlike orcs, Trolls and Evel Morghoth and Sauron) So that is what makes him so evil.

***

I dont like the idea of you guys all bringing Boromirs death only as an example of the evil of the ring.
Author:  Herenya [ November 21st, 2005, 5:34 pm ]
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Hm, I don't think that Boromir was mad. Nor do I agree that you should put "mad" people away. (It's not their fault they have mental illnesses!)

The ring might make Suaron evil, but he made it. Ultimately, the way Sauron is presented in the story, he's the 'ultimate' evil. Whether he dies or not is beside the point, because he's so wrapped up in the ring, so to speak.

If you look at other characters who are in a similar boat - Saruman, Grima, Gollum even, you will notice that they bring on their own destruction. Most of those around them (the ones with the voting power, the main characters, the good guys) are hesitant to kill them, and don't do so...
However, these characters end up dead. What might be necessary to the plot, doesn't mean that the characters 'deserve' death.
Author:  Nauriel Rochnur [ November 23rd, 2005, 11:59 pm ]
Post subject: 
I don't think he deserved to die. He got caught up in the corruption of the ring, which, yes, was wrong. But according to my hebrew scriptures teacher, since all humans are imperfect, we cannot possibly follow the laws completly, including moral ones, and are therefore doomed to break the law, even if we try our hardest. That's just the way it is. *sigh*
Sorry to bring up this theology thing, but I think its relevent.
What matters is that Boromir relized that what he did was wrong, and tried to repent. Unfortunatly, that ended in him getting shot multiple times and dying *again, sigh*
This is what makes him different from Sauron, Grima, gollum , and them all. They didn't give a hoot that what they were doing was cruel, horrendous, and not to mention just downright mean. Boromir did.
Well, that's my view on it.
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