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Even In Darkness [Updating]

Well they had to trick the Silents who were by this time the true masters of the human race. Consider what the Doctor said, the Silents aren't exactly keen on letting them lead the revolution against them.

Overall terrific start to the season.

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I was cured all right.

Holy crap I near about peed my pants and swallowed my tongue after watching this.

First off. Holy. Crap. That kid is a Time Lord. My personal theory is that the baby is Amy's, the reason being because we saw that picture of Amy holding a baby. Her fear that spending so long in the TARDIS could affect her baby is true, and in a sense she is having the TARDIS's baby. Lets just hope it doesn't have a time head . I wouldn't be apposed to it being River's, and in fact I think that would be adorable, but personally I think its more probable that the kid is Amy's

And second of all, how cute where River and the Doctor together!? I loved their flirting, and they have some of the best banter, ever. The whole "Well why don't you make me?" "Well, maybe I will" was way too adorable to watch juts once (yeah, I rewatched that scene 5 or 6 times. Don't judge!) And then they kissed! Wow. I squeed. I'm not going to lie, I squeed my little fan girl heart out. Soo cute. The Doctor looked entirely awkward. It was sad though, realizing that even though it was the Doctor's first time kissing River, that River would never kiss him again.

Third of all, Rory and Amy are a cute couple themselves. I started crying when Amy called Rory a stupid head as he was trying to untie her, and realized that she had been talking about him, not the Doctor. Oh my gosh, I need a boyfriend like Rory.

As for the way that the Doctor defeated the Silents....that just gave me chills. The guy scares me sometimes, with his ingenuity and brutality he can muster in order to defend the human race. Let me just say this: I am NEVER getting on the Doctor's bad side. Never.

Have all the season premier episodes been this damn good? Is it the agonizingly long wait that makes these episodes seem so awesome, or is this season just kicking some major ass?

Personally, I think its the latter.

That was SUCH an amazing episode! I was just like, "WHAT, WHAT?" during every commercial break, but it was still awesome.

I really loved that we were kept out of everything as well. We didn't know they had an encounter with the Silents until they realized it as well. I thought that was brilliantly done.

The Doctor managing to have them give their own execution order...so chilling. I'm with you Naur, NEVER get on the Doctor's bad side.

I still don't quite know how I feel about River. She is totally awesome just in how she is, but I'm still on the fence about her and the Doctor. So their flirting was funny (especially Amy's "Hello? I'm here?") and the kiss was...well, I dunno. I felt so bad for River. "And a last time." And the Doctor being not sure about what to do. But I'm not sure how I feel about that progressing.

WHAT IS UP WITH THE GIRL? Who's daughter is she? And is she really a time lord? And gah, I am so confused right now. And what did the Silents want with her in the first place, and the whole space suit? THAT WAS NOT EXPLAINED. Also, random woman at random window in the door that disappeared. WHAT?

When Amy was saying the "Dropped out of the sky" bit, my friends and I all went nuts saying things like "Hang on, I thought Karen said Rory was fully established as her love" and "Rory deserves better" and "WHAAT?" So we were very happy with he calling him stupid face. I squeed inside. And maybe a little out loud too. I <3 Rory.

Also, I'd love Mark Sheppard to come back. But I don't think it's going to happen, sadly.

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going on a journey through my old claims

Okay, here is the theory to top all theories. Okay, the little girl is. . .River and the Doctor's! Because there are all those hints to them being married, right? And that picture of Amy is only there because she's a close "family friend" and wanted to hold the baby. You know, everybody does that with babies! Anywho, River's cool. Not awesome quite yet, but still cool. She does have the best lines! I liked in the first episode, "Hippie." "Archeologist." That was funny!

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AKA Crutchie


Click here to visit my site!

I've finally watched all the episodes (well, not ALL, but the new ones, since 2005) so I can join this club without risking any spoilers now (can I join this club pretty please? ). This might be really boring for you guys but I need to get out some thoughts I've had while I watched, having had no one to talk to about it because of the previously mentioned spoilers I didn't want to risk.

1. Why did they use Freema Agyeman in that one episode right before Martha Jones came along? Or rather, why did they use her for Martha when they'd already used her in an earlier episode? I'm not saying I don't think she was a good Martha, she was a very good Martha, I rather liked Martha, but that bugged me. I guess it's the kind of thing you notice when you watch 5+ seasons of a show in something like 3 weeks.

2. The Vashta Nerada are probably the scariest thing ever. Probably because I used to be scared of the dark and secretly still am. Also, the Weeping Angels.

3. The Silence WERE scary, until they (it?) weren't because the Doctor figured them out. They maybe still are though. I don't know. They might come back.

4. Do the Daleks NEVER die?!

5. I think Nine is my favorite doctor. I'm not sure. Maybe Ten. Maybe even Eleven. But I think Nine.

6. I'm not sure I like how the show changed after Eleven came along. It's quite different. Like, new Doctor, new companion, new TARDIS, new everything. And he's so different from Nine and Ten. And it's like Rose and Martha and Donna (whom I didn't like cause I thought she was annoying but also sort of badass which was cool) never happened.

7. Rose and the other Ten kissing is probably my favorite moment ever. If I wasn't so lazy I'd go back and watch it again and again and again and again because I loved Rose (even though she didn't do right by Mickey) and I was SO sad when he didn't get the time to say he loved her.

8. "Does it even need saying?" OH MY LORD DYING.

9. Martha and Mickey got married?! WHAT?! What happened to that other guy? The one she was ENGAGED to?

10. Wow, this is getting long. Okay, one final thing. I don't like River Song. She annoys me. She looks so much older than the Doctor. And yes I know he's like a thousand years old but he doesn't LOOK it. And she looks older. And I want him to be with Rose. Even though he sorta is. But still. Not with River.

/end rant. Feel free to ignore it.

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by Lembas

Yes, welcome Anameleth! Its aways good to have another Whovian here

Btw, your questions/comments aren't boring. We're all hardcore Doctor Who fans here

1) I think the produced just realized that "Hey, this chick is a good actor. We may have used her once before, but she's good and we know she can act. Lets hire her." They just liked her and decided that she would do well in a bigger role.

2)Those things are creepy. I may be 21, but I still have a small fear of the dark. I always feel like there's something behind me that can see me, even though I can't see it. I think something that all scary Doctor Who monsters have in common is that there's something inherently creepy about them. With the Vashta Nerada, it plays a lot on the childhood fear of darkness (something that I am convinced many adults still carry). It confirms our beliefs that yes, there is something out there in the darkness, and it is evil. It wants to hurt you, so you *should* fear the darkness. With the Weeping Angels, the scariness comes from the fact that you have to look at them. You have to face them, or else the will get you. A very human reaction to a threat is to run away. We turn our backs and run like blazes, as if by not looking at the threat we can make it go away. The exact opposite is true with the Weeping Angels. If you do not look at them, they will eat you. You *have*to look at them. You have to make yourself turn and look at the threat. It goes against human nature, which is why they are so creepy. As for the Silents...they're just ten gallons of creepy in a one quart bag. Looks aside, just thinking that you could be seeing these creatures many times a day and not even know it freaks me out. Then there are the looks, which lets face it, are scary in their own rights. I think the disjointed mixture of horribly deformed monster dressed in a nice suit is disturbing. They're not just monsters. They are sophisticated, clever, and organized. They are an intelligent monster.

3)I have to say, I hope the Silents come back. I'd certainly be disappointed if that was all we got from the Silents after the build up of last season. You have to consider too that there's still that little girl. From what I gathered, the Silents made the suit that the girl was living in. My guess is that they will bring the Silents back when they explain why they put her in the suit in the first place.

4)I'll agree with you there. Daleks as individuals seem to die pretty easily. Its killing *all* of them before they can make more of each other that seems to be the problem. And, I don't think the Daleks will ever be killed off for good. They're the Doctor's number one enemy. It wouldn't be Doctor Who without the Daleks.

5) When I first started watching Doctor Who, it was with Christopher Eccleston. I was devastated to learn that he was leaving. I didn't think that anyone could replace him, especially not that dorky looking David Tennant. However, once I saw David Tennant in action, I was sold. He replaced Christopher Eccleston as my favorite Doctor. I was enraptured by how great he was in the role. Then came the inevitable news that he was quitting Doctor Who. And, just like with Christopher Eccleston, I didn't think that anyone could replace him. Boy was I wrong. Matt Smith not only filled David Tennant's shoes, he had to buy a bigger size. I'm blown away by how great of a job he is doing.

6) I know what you mean. At first I was a bit wary of the change. I didn't like how the changed the Doctor, theme song, screwdriver, TARDIS interior, and logo all at the same time. However, after awhile it was like a breath of fresh air. To be honest, the Tenth Doctor was going a bit stale on me. I felt like he was becoming waaaaay too angsty, and every other scene was of him and his weepy puppy dog eyes. To see a young peppy new Doctor was a relief.

7) That was a very sweet moment. It wasn't my favorite, but a sweet moment nonetheless

9)What? When was this? As far as I know, Martha did get married to that one guy. Huh....

10) I think its interesting that you're still focused on Rose. You watched all the episodes in a matter of weeks, where as Rose is years old to me. I don't really remember her that much, to be honest. I remember being sad that she was leaving, but now I don't miss her. Too much time has passed. I think that having all the time between seasons changes your perspective. When you watch all the seasons together, you're able to compare the characters to one another. Personally, I like River. At first I wasn't too sure about her, but after watching the chemistry between her and the Doctor in Day of the Moon, I'm a sold little shipper. I'm still not positive that they're the best match personality wise and morality wise, but seeing them flirt and banter with each other was just too cute. I think the Doctor needs someone he can't quite handle. He's so used to being the genius mastermind, one step ahead of everyone else. Having someone that can sometimes look down at him from those stairs is something new to him, and I think he enjoys it.

Yay thanks

In that one episode (I'm really bad at episode names...) where Ten goes around saying bye to everyone (or not saying it, as it were), and he's looking down at Martha and Mickey, Mickey says something that I didn't quite catch, and Martha says "well you shouldn't have married me, then".

I think Christopher Eccleston really didn't stay long enough. I was just getting properly used to him and enjoying his quirks, so to speak, when Ten came along. But I get what you mean about David Tennant sort of out-staying his welcome There was a lot of sad in his last episodes. But I think that's the reason I'm still not completely used to Matt Smith, because it was such a transition. The Doctor sorta went from always being sad to never being sad, which seemed a bit strange. I'm starting to love him though. And I like his relationship with Amy and Rory.

As for River, I kinda thought she worked better with Ten. Like, there was more natural chemistry there despite the fact it was only something like one or two episodes. Whereas I feel like with Eleven there's a kind of forced chemistry because there has to be. She might grow on me though.

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by Lembas

Welcome to the fandom, Anameleth ! It's good to have you on board 8). Now, to your thoughts.
1) I noticed that too when I watched those seasons. I thought it was odd as well, but I'm going to agree with Nauriel Rochnur- the producers were so impressed with her that they wanted to bring her back in a leading role. They've done it recently, too. Karen Gillan, who plays Amy, was originally cast as one of the seers in "The Fires Of Pompeii". I haven't had the opportunity to watch it again and look for her, but once it comes up, I definitely will . Also, going back to Freema Agyeman being cast as Martha, I think in the S3 premiere ep, "Smith And Jones", Ten notices the resemblance. Martha's answer when he says something like, "Wait, I thought you'd died at Canary Wharf!" is that the girl was her cousin.

2) I thought they were pretty scary, too, but the creature at the top of my list is the one from "Midnight", chiefly because (1) we never actually see what it is, and (2) the way it exerts such a powerful influence over the passengers on the transport. I've seen that ep probably half a dozen times at least, and I've gotten freaked out every single time. After that, it's the Weeping Angels.

3) They were, I agree . They didn't quite approach the scariness of, say, the Weeping Angels for me, but they came pretty close, just on their appearance alone. Add the fact that as soon as you look away, you don't remember them, and they're pretty shudder-worthy =[! I don't think we've seen the last of them yet, either B).

4) Hehe, afraid not 8D. It's like Nauriel Rochnur said- they're part of the show's history and legacy, so they won't be going anywhere anytime soon (to be honest, if they were gotten rid of permanently, I think there'd probably be an uprising in the fandom :]). We could do with a bit of a vacation from them, though, as IMO, anyway, RTD really overused them during his tenure as showrunner :/.

5) Yeah 8)? Ten is mine, followed closely by Eleven. I've watched the entirety of S1 a couple of times, making sure to keep out thoughts like, "Hey, that's not the Doctor :/!" and "Waah, where's Ten :[? I want to see him :\", but I've just never been able to get that attached to Nine. I liked him well enough, but he just didn't grab me the way Ten did, and the way Eleven is currently doing. I think a good part of that is the fact that we only had him for one season. It might be different if we'd had two seasons or more, but we didn't. I guess to put it another way, since we only saw him for one season, there wasn't enough time for me to get to "know" him, so I wasn't devastated when he regenerated, whereas when Ten did, I was practically bawling. But hey, each to their own, right :]?

6) Interesting. I understand where you're coming from, though. That's a lot to change in one fell swoop :]. My acceptance, for lack of a better word, of this second reboot of the show happened pretty rapidly. To give you an idea, this is how I reacted when Ten regenerated into Eleven: I was sitting there watching, tears rolling down my face, then David Tennant turned into Matt Smith, and the Doctor started rejoicing over the fact that he had all his limbs & nothing had gone wrong with the regeneration. Around that time, in the midst of tears, a smile began forming on my face, and as soon as he said, "Still not ginger!", I started laughing. In other words, I'd mourned over the departure of "my" Doctor, and had become very excited to get to know the new one all within a couple of minutes. The one thing that is still eluding me is the sort of attachment to Amy & Rory that I had to Donna (she's my personal fave companion), Rose, and Martha. Rory is beginning to grow on me, and Amy a little bit (I absolutely loved the fact that she pretty much remembered the Doctor back into existence 8 )!), but I don't have the same emotional investment in them as I did with the other three. That may change, though, depending on how the rest of this current season plays out :].

7) That's definitely one of my favorite moments . Not my most favorite, though. Honestly, I have so many that I'm not sure which is at the top of my list .

8) I don't recall what ep that's from, or who's being addressed, so I can't really say much about that, sorry :}.

9) I had the same reaction when I saw that. I thought, "Wait, what happened to her and Tom =\?!" It bugged me at the time, but after reading someone's theory about the reason for that on, I believe, Gallifrey Base (that's THE site to be a member of if you've been part of the DW fandom for awhile), I more or less accepted it. The person's theory was, I think, that RTD did that because it was the only way to tie up both their stories without making one or both of them part of the Torchwood cast (That's what I personally chose to do with them both in a couple of AU fanfics I'm working on, but I'm not RTD, so it's neither here nor there. *Shrugs* ).

10) Ah, see, I absolutely love River 8). Have since we first got introduced to her in "Silence In The Library"/"Forest Of The Dead" from S4 :]. Her appearances in S5 made me love her even more, and that trend is continuing in this current one. I think she, more than any other companion, at least of the female persuasion, is the Doctor's equal in, well, just about everything 8D. Donna came very close to being that for him, but the fact that her human mind couldn't handle all the genius and knowledge after she became the DoctorDonna put her at a disadvantage, unfortunately . I also love the fact that, as Nauriel Rochnur said, there are times when River knows more about the Doctor than the Doctor himself, something he both likes and hates. In other words, IMO, anyway, she's a more mysterious, kick-butt version of Donna, which is probably another reason I like her so much 8).

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The end is where we start from.
– Captain Jack Harkness

Aha Ana, I see you are one of those Rose people.



It's okay, I guess we can still keep you.

2. I love how Doctor Who is good at playing on basic fears. Darkness, something out of the corner of your eye, all that. Brilliance.

4. I'd heard somewhere that originally the Daleks weren't going to be in the new series, then the person who had control over that relented. Perhaps a result is that they have to appear once a season? Dunno. But they certainly were a bit overused. It was nice to only see them briefly for series 5.

5. I love Nine! I love Eleven a bit more, but Nine is fantastic. He doesn't get enough credit for restarting the series, IMO. People just tend to skip over him. But he's important and a good Doctor.

6. For me, it was a breath of fresh air when Eleven came in. Ten had been getting just too human and angsty and yeah... I was glad to have the Doctor back, instead of the pining teenager. As for it being like Donna and Martha and Rose had never happened, I think Naur has a good point. Watching them all within a month or two is very different from watching them over six years. By the time series 5 rolled around, it had been a full year since the end of series 4. Everything was sort of put to rest. There was one brief bit of Donna, but that was it. And him dredging up thoughts about old companions -- where would he stop? He's had a lot of companions, so it's got to be limited or the show would be about some guy talking about everyone he's ever traveled with. I think it makes sense that companions would sort of only be during the duration of their Doctor. Rose obviously was there for the transition, so she got two. But yeah.


Our reactions are almost exact, but I think the "dying" is a bit different for each of us. Mine was a bit more of a "tear out my eyes and stop up my ears and maybe shout at the TV screen a bit."

9. I KNOW, RIGHT? That bothers me too. What the heck happened with Tom? She was ENGAGED to him! And then all of a sudden it's like, oh hey, me and Mickey are married now. It's almost like the "we're the two unattached and less important ones so we're going to be put together" thing. Though I try to rationalize it in that Mickey and Martha had both experienced a lot with the Doctor, and somehow Martha just wasn't able to make it with a man who didn't understand that part of her life.

10. I'm still not sure how I feel about River. She's a FANTASTIC character, and mysterious and intriguing and really awesome, but I don't know about her and the Doctor yet. We'll see.


Disclaimer: No hard feelings were meant to come out of this post. All opinions relating to Rose, Ten, Eleven, River, and other companions or storylines are the property of their opinionators and not subject to criticism.


One more thing - everyone says the Weeping Angels are scary. Personally, I find them less scary than others. There's something creepy but almost exhilarating in the way they act. I find them fascinating, not scary. Yeah, if one was right in front of me I'd be terrified because I'd have to look at it, but it just sending me back in time could be kind of cool.

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going on a journey through my old claims

I love how everyone is commenting on my comments It makes me reflect more on them, and you guys have actually made me change my opinions on some things

I actually like Eleven a lot more now than I did at first. He's become his own Doctor while still keeping the important elements of Nine and Ten.
I'm sure you can all agree with me on this though: What is up with Rory dying all the time?! I mean, by now it's like "oh, he died again, I'm sure they can revive him..."
I guess if he ever actually DOES die, there's going to be an outrage. And people probably won't believe he's dead for real I'm not the biggest Rory-fan, but I think it's very important for Amy's sanity that he's there.

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by Lembas

^Yes to the "oh, he died again, I'm sure they can revive him..."

But I like it most when all 3 (or 4) of them are in danger, it sets the stakes higher because then they actually have to work together to get out of the same situation. . .

Oh, and did anyone else (besides me) think that it was a bit weird when 11 just stood up and walked over to the TARDIS console after Rory came back alive? It was like he didn't really care. . . .or maybe the excitement was over and he had to start flying the TARDIS again, I dunno. And what's up with Amy being Negative/Positive that keeps switching around?

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AKA Crutchie


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I noticed that too, but I found it to be more a moment of him breathing a sigh of relief then walking away because he didn't care. It was a "Oh thank god he's alive" moment.

But I'll agree with you all; Rory sure seems to die a lot. He's like the Daniel Jackson of Doctor Who (Stargate reference! Sorry guys ).

As for Amy's pregnancy scan coming shifting between positive and negative...well, I don't really know. We're for sure going to learn more about it in the coming episodes, but I don't know why it keeps shifting.

And what do you guys think about that lady with the eye patch that appears to Amy through the window thingy? I have a theory that there's going to be an episode where the whole plot is that Amy is in a mental institution and they try to convince her that the Doctor is just in her imagination; the lady with the eye patch is looking at her through one of those insane asylum door thingies.

I'm in agreement about the whole "Rory dying all the time" thing, too :/. I'm not quite to the point where all I think is, "Oh please, not again B/!", though. When he died in "The Curse Of The Black Spot", I just reacted with mild amusement. The thought that went through my mind was more or less, "Really, guys ? Come on . But if they keep killing him off and bringing him back, it is going to become tiresome after awhile :\. Either kill him off for good (though I kind of doubt they'll do that), or don't always make him the one who ends up in grave danger.

Harthad- I believe someone who wrote a review of "Day Of The Moon" described that as a "Schroedinger Pregnancy". Basically, Moffat and company want us to question whether she actually is pregnant. To put it another way, they want us to ask, "Okay, is she really carrying a child, or was that just an idea the Silence planted in her mind for some reason or another?" I saw another person somewhere else online theorize that the reason that's happening is because the baby isn't pure human, but part human and part Timelord, so its genetics don't quite match up.

Nauriel Rochnur- Yes, I'm wondering who "Eye patch lady" is as well . She appeared once at some point in "Day Of The Moon", too, and was youngish & blonde. When she appeared in "The Curse Of The Black Spot", though, she was older and dark-haired (might possibly have been two different characters, too). On both occasions, I wondered out loud, "Who the heck is that woman? And why does she (and the little door she peeks out of) suddenly disappear when Amy looks away then back again ?" Very, very strange =\! Still, knowing Moffat and keeping in mind last season, there's probably some reason for that character's (or characters') presence :[.

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The end is where we start from.
– Captain Jack Harkness

I think the lady with the eye patch is either the little girl grown up or a Time Lady.

I hope the Daleks don't show up in this series. It'll be nice if they didn't show up without any warning to steal the scenes. Unless they and the Silence get into a fight. Now that would kick ASS!

Rory does die a lot or almost die, doesn't he? Honestly, the Doctor should just lock him in the TARDIS anytime they go out. Well actually let's see...

In "Amy's Choice", he gets attacked by the old pensioners and dies in the dream world.
In "Cold Blood", he gets shot by the Siliurian and then promptly erased from time.
In "Day of the Moon", he gets faux!shot by Canton and delivered to the Doctor in Area 51.
And in "Curse of the Black Spot", he knocked overboard into the ocean and drown.

Yeah, pretty danger happy there, mate.

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I was cured all right.

^Lol. Now, I have a question about Day of the Moon. Was the whole beginning 'let's shoot Amy and Rory and lock the Doctor up!' thing planted in Canton's mind by the Silence? Because that wasn't very clear to me.

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AKA Crutchie


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