How about steel?

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Faith isn't the ability to believe long and far into the misty future.
It's simply taking God at His Word and taking the next step Joni Erickson Tada

No, it wasn't steel. It was a black metal, harder and more malleable than steel. Was it named....galvorn? I think that might be it. I know what you're talking about, I just don't remember if it's called galvorn or not.

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You are 100% correct Aerandir!! Eols armour was made out of galvorn indeed. I was worried no one would know the answer. Yor turn now I believe.
Elrond

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"This is the hour of the Shire-folk, when they arise from their quiet fields to shake the towers and counsels of the Great. Who of all the Wise could have foreseen it? Or, if they are wise, why should they expect to know it, until the hour has struck? "

w00t for me.

Hmm....just to be see everyone's opinions, and because I haven't read the book in around six months, and because I'm feeling too lazy to come up with a hard question, how many Valar were there and who were they?

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lol too lazy, eh? Well, can understand you

12 Valars, 6 male and 6 female... here they are:

Manwe
Mandos
Ulmo
Aule
Lorien/Irmo
Tulkas

Varda
Yavanna
Nienna
Vana
Vaire
Nessa

And Melkor/MOrgoth of course...
Any more questions?

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Hah. I knew I'd catch someone with it. It's really an impossible question, so I'll let you by with it.

I'll just point out that all of the Valar who were named in The Silmarillion were also labelled as the 'Lords/Ladies' of the Valar.....so it is implied that there are more, unmentioned ones.

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lol Well, of course there are more, though those are the only ones known by name I believe. I hope I`m right there... anyways... next question...

Who was the ruler of Thargelion over a long period of time in the first age?

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Was it Finwe?

Love the sig, did you draw it?

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Faith isn't the ability to believe long and far into the misty future.
It's simply taking God at His Word and taking the next step Joni Erickson Tada

Caranthir I think it was. Am I right?
Elrond

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"This is the hour of the Shire-folk, when they arise from their quiet fields to shake the towers and counsels of the Great. Who of all the Wise could have foreseen it? Or, if they are wise, why should they expect to know it, until the hour has struck? "

Err Erana your answer was wrong. At least you forgot two of the known Valar. The kings and queens of the Valar were 7 each so it's 14 all in all. You left out Orome but I forgot the other one
Whatever...

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><>Son of God, brother of Jesus. I've got the best family I could have imagined! Saved by his mercy and love. What else could I wish for?<><

No, I told her it was fine, since she couldn't really get all of them anyways.

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Going back to Aerandir's question, no one is right thus far. Originally there were 15 Valar. Melkor was expelled from that order because of his corruption. The names of the 14 Valar are as follows:

Lords of the Valar

Manwë Súlimo
Ulmo
Aulë
Oromë
Mandos (Námo)
Lórien (Irmo)
Tulkas Astaldo

Queens of the Valar (Valier)

Varda Elentári
Yavanna Kementári
Nienna
Estë the Gentle
Vairë the Weaver
Vána the Ever-young
Nessa

However, I believe you have misinterpreted Aerandir. The valar are accounted for in that list, there are not countless Valar; we know the names of all of them. To what the quote you used refers (I believe) is the Ainur. They were countless, but only 15 were ever Valar. The rest would have made up the Maiar, for whom the Valar were Lords and Ladies.

Well, there are certainly not countless Valar, but the way Tolkien words that section of The Silmarillion leads me to believe that there are more than just the named ones.



Well, if I was in Tolkien's place, I would use the term 'Lord' referring to someone of higher rank than someone else, and I wouldn't use it at all if there was already a classification that meant the same thing, such as 'Vala'. Likewise, I wouldn't use the term 'Queen' unless the character in question actually ruled something. At least following my own logic, I tend to think that there are more Valar than are named.

However, I already told Erana that her answer was okay and that she could ask her question, which The Lamenter answered. Since Erana hasn't come back yet, and The Lamenter's answer was correct, I'd say it'd be fine if he asked his question now.

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After reading that quote in context for myself, I can see why you believe what you do. However, I stand by the fact that, whilst the phrasing might imply more, there are just the 14 Valar, and they are 'lords and queens' over the Maiar, rather than other Valar.

Perhaps what I mean is that rather than being Lords of the Valar, they are actually Lords of the Ainur (Though I know that is not what is written). And thus they do rule, but not over other Valar.

And surely, if there were going to be lords over other Valar, surely there would be a similar structure to the Maiar? but the Maiar are all assign to the 'people' of one or other of the Valar.

Well, I don't know about the Maiar, but I don't think that the phrase "Queens of the Valar" really works if you think of it as "Queens of the Maiar." So I still think that there are more.

However, since it all rests with that one paragraph, which can be taken mor than one way, I think that it's best if we just drop it, because I doubt either one will sway the other, and I don't want to just bicker over it.

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I'm sort of confused now. Could anyone tell me whose turn it is or ask a question?

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><>Son of God, brother of Jesus. I've got the best family I could have imagined! Saved by his mercy and love. What else could I wish for?<><