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Post subject:  Posted: January 19th, 2010, 8:34 pm |
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Calloniel (PD) wrote: The island develops them. Look at Sawyer! He becomes just a wonderful guy in season 4! Kate, well, she just seems to whine a lot about it without really… changing. I dunno. She doesn't buck up and take it.
I don't know... I think with Kate the Island had the opposite effect. She was a very assertive, go-out-and-get-it, I-can-do-anything sort of person and the Island broke her.
(P.S. Your Wall-E banner is gorgeous and so adorable!) _________________ 
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 8:39 pm |
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Taurquende wrote: I don't know... I think with Kate the Island had the opposite effect. She was a very assertive, go-out-and-get-it, I-can-do-anything sort of person and the Island broke her.
well, I'm honestly not so sure of that... all those annoying "I'm going with you"s show her go-out-and-get-it nature. Her self confidence when it comes to going EVERYWHERE with them and always being the one to do whatever (like the whole carrying the dynamite in the season 1 finale) doesn't seem overly daunted. 
hehe, thanks!  _________________ Chase a couple hearts, we could leave 'em in shreds
Meet me in the gutter, make the devil your friend
Just remember what I said, cause it isn't over yet
Get.Lost.In.The.Dark.To.Find.Yourself
-sig by Loafers-
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 9:03 pm |
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Johnny's Fan wrote: So yeah... I'm basically just pleading that this thread isn't going to become a Kate-Jack hate fest or something. Oh my. Looking back at a few of the posts I write today, they do seem pretty harsh. My apologies, everyone! This is just a TV show, and the characters aren't real (but oh, how I wish they were!).  I used to love Kate so much. She and Sawyer were my favorites from the start, and I still like her in the first few seasons. My dislike started in the third season, but I still find qualities in her that I love. I agree with you, JF, that her care of Aaron was very touching and honorable. I think her struggle with her past is very hard for her, although I think it's gotten a bit tedious and drawn out. I don't think I dislike her as much as I seem to right now, and I do hope she has a happy ending...in the end (where else would you have a happy ending?). Quote: I mean, if we're talking about hating characters who harm our favourites, Sayid would be DEAD for harming Ben. Totally D-E-A-D. And Juliet as well.
You know, Sayid has become one of my very favorites.  I don't even hate him for torturing Sawyer in the beginning. *le gasp* I love characters with especially tortured pasts, and I think that's why I love Sawyer so much. It's not that he's perfect or morally a better character than Jack at all! Sawyer has many, many problems, and I agree with all of you that Jack really is the good guy of the two. But...I don't always like the good guys. It's the look in Sawyer's eyes when he thinks or talks about his past, that look of guilt and regret for what he's done. That's why I love him. That's also why I like Skate more than Jate. Sawyer and Kate are both very troubled people, and I do think that Kate would be better with Jack. BUT...I think Sawyer and Kate started to heal each other in the first few seasons, and they have a chemistry that I'm drawn to. They clearly have a dump truck load of issues (Sawyer was not exactly a gentleman), but they've both changed so much that I think it would be possible for them to be together.
Well, maybe you can PM me about it, PD! I would very much like to know this spoiler.
My sister and I were watching that strangulation scene together, and I had to turn down the volume and scroll down the screen.  It was INSANELY unexpected, and I'm just not huge on intense violence like that. I mean, that's a creepy way to die! haha
DesmondxPenny forever! Whooo!!! I teared up a bit when I watched The Constant. So beautiful.
I'm not really sure what happened with Kate. I think she's still confident, but the Island showed her her weaknesses for sure. I think I agree with Taur, but also with PD. _________________ 
i'm back for a little! i'll see how this visit goes.
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 9:42 pm |
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Joined: 19 May 2007
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You people are messed up. Jack pwns all.
Nah... I mean, he does, but... 'tis cool... More Jack for me... that's all...
*cough*
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 10:24 pm |
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Maybe you're right... maybe her being confused is too much of an excuse.
But here we have a female who was abused by her step-father and saw her mother abused by the same man. So desperate was she to help her mother, she killed the man and tried to make her mother's life better. Mother turned her in, Kate was on the run. And lots of things inbetween.
I truly believe she loves Jack, but there is something normal about him that frightens her. Sawyer is almost one of her own kind, even more than Jack, he understands her better.
Actually... I am going to stick with the confusion thing, because it's a lot more complex than which guy looks better or who will be better to spend the night with. Kate is such a complex character. I don't find her annoying at all. She is logical, usually calm, capable and sometimes it's a bit scary as to what lengths she can and will go to get something done. But then again, she killed a man for a good reason, although some would say it was wrong at all.
And I think the island does nothing for a persons character. I think Locke is the only one to come out of it a different person and that's because he has some weird thing going on with the island. I also agree with Taur, the island has broken Kate - she is not the person she was when she arrived and living her new life with Aaron is not necessarily what she wanted.
So.. yeah. I was a Skate fan to begin with, but I think Jack is what Kate needs, and I think she is good for Jack. Kate would not bring happiness to Sawyer and vice versa. The woman's heart he broke, he needs to mend.
*cough*
There is a lack of SAVE TEH FRANK here. That makes me unhappy. 
Oh, and I want Miles to live as well. I like Miles. 
Question to everyone: [season 5 spoiler] does anyone think it mean that the 6 of them have been off the island for 3 years, and yet they seem happy to have not tried to do anything to get back? Except maybe Sun and Sayid? Does it sound right to you, that with their resources pooled, they were willing to leave them?
And what do you think happened to the other Losties, back on the island who are not living with the Dharma people? Are Rose and Bernard the only ones left? Would Sawyer really have left them to fend for themselves? Would Rose and Bernard really abandon their fellow survivors?
_________________ 
^ By me and my SS *squiggle hugs*
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 10:31 pm |
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JF makes a good case for Kate, my friends... Kate... she has her moments where I totally want to kill her. I found her terribly annoying in parts of season 3 and 4... sleeping with Sawyer and then jealous of Jack and Juliet. You're like... pick one and stick to it. But... whatever. She's on and off. Not nearly my favourite... but not like a certain *ahem* Locke.  I think her and Jack should, and likely will, end up together. 
In any case... I have absolutely no season 6 theories... none.
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 10:52 pm |
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 11:38 pm |
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SR, I might… not tonight ‘cause I need to head to bed. But yeah.
You know, I still don’t think Ben went into that hotel room planning on killing Locke.  there’s just something… I dunno. I’m not sure when he decided to do it but I don’t think he had it planned from the start. But it IS freaky.
I KNOW! That phone call scene is one of the best scenes ever!
*bonks TT* you know you deserved that.
Well, JF, we might just have to agree to disagree about Kate ‘cause honestly I don’t agree with almost anything you said about her. (especially about the Island doing nothing for a person’s character ) and, heck, if you really don’t like her we probably could have this same convo only reversed about Juliet. Lol I think everyone probably has charries they dislike in LOST… just ask TT about Locke.
MILES! You know, he’s sorta an unsung epic charrie, I think. 
You know, I JUST thought of that today while watching an ep of season 5. And… well, it did strike me as sorta mean that Jack, Hurley and Kate (well, not Kate but we won’t go there ) never wanted to or cared about going back… especially Jack and Kate. It just seemed a little cold. I mean the way Jack was so leaderish it seems like he would’ve felt awful for leaving people behind. 
I think that with all that was going on the night everyone got separated it was probably pretty easy to get sidetrack and just… well, who knows. Also Sawyer, Juliet and the rest didn’t know (after the flashes and stuff) if the others were alive, in the same time, or not. I mean, who knows.
_________________ Chase a couple hearts, we could leave 'em in shreds
Meet me in the gutter, make the devil your friend
Just remember what I said, cause it isn't over yet
Get.Lost.In.The.Dark.To.Find.Yourself
-sig by Loafers-
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Post subject: Posted: January 19th, 2010, 11:57 pm |
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Post subject: Posted: January 20th, 2010, 5:44 am |
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About the island changing characters: I don't really think the Island changes characters but more or less takes out the best or worst in some people. Take Jack, he always had the urge to help, lead and fix but never really could express it to the full measure until they came on the island. Sawyer, well Sawyer has always been after personal gain. In all those cons he never thought of the ones he might hurt, but only of his own good. I think his urge to 'survive' as he calls it is also boosted on the island..
I think indeed that Miles is a 'good' guy, although this seemed different because of his offensive and mysterious behaviour at the beginning. I think it's surprising how Hurley can coope with this Sawyer-look-a-like
About the Constant: I t hink this was one of the best episodes of the entire season. I loved Daniel's role (past and future) and Desmond is just so adorable. The phone call was epic and really got me teared up...
Hmm, I agree with PD that it was really cruel of the Oceanic Six just to get on with their life even without even thinking of saving the others. But I think that finally (especially with Jack and Kate) some kind of selfishness overtook them. I mean, after everything they went through to get off the Island, they are finally given the chance to live a 'normal' life, especially when Kate is not found guilty on the charges. So.. yeah, I kind of understand them, but it's still cold. *nods*
Hurray for having the LOST!-rambling going again! *groupshug* _________________
O children, lift up your voice, lift up your voice,
Children, rejoice, rejoice..
It doesn't matter you don't believe in God, He believes in you.
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Post subject: Posted: January 20th, 2010, 12:21 pm |
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Yeah, I think the events on island would be enough to change people or make them adapt to things that are beyond the normal. I don't see the island effecting people's characters as much as it seems to effect certain people who are ill, I think it's just like anything that happens to a person that requires the old survival instinct to kick in so someone like Sawyer who is a loner, has probably realised it is better for himself to work with people, and then as time has gone on (as you would expect) he has come to like and bond with certain people, so it's not longer for a selfish interest that he is helping people.
Miles is a very interesting character. I mean when he screamed at Juliet "WHERE IS HE??!!" I was like... whoa dude... but I'm not sure if he was just really fed up with his job and wanted out, more so than he himself wants Ben dead. I do like that scene though... I watch it all the time on Youtube... not for Juliet or Miles I have to say.... 
My feeling is though: did they all not pick up a lot of money for the crash? They then would have had the means to "on the side" be finding out what happened to the island. I also don't get Desmond and Penny. They KNOW her dad was behind it all, she HAD the means to find it once... I just find it morally wrong that they would all go back and live life and forget about what happened on the island "to protect people". I think after a while that would have become the cowards words because if they had told the truth originally, outsiders like Penny and Frank would have backed them up. But the least they could do was to try and find people, and then decide how they would tell the world.
And considering no one ever told anyone anything, they left people on that island completely uninformed about pretty much anything that went on in the last series and a half.
So... none of them get cookies from me for being good human beings to their fellow survivors. And Sun is going all ninja woman on us as well...she's not bothered about the people on the island anymore than the rest of them, just Jin. Which is understandale.. but there were others who were on the island.
And are the children survivors still with the Others who Ben told to go to the Temple? It's been a while since we have heard or seen any Others.
Has anyone seen to the promo pic for season 6? The one that looks like the Last Supper?
:hugs: all the Losties!
_________________
^ By me and my SS *squiggle hugs*
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Post subject: Posted: January 20th, 2010, 5:38 pm |
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Wow. There have been lots of new conversations started, and I have no idea where to jump in.
I think the Island has forced people to come to terms with their weaknesses. Everyone keeps on using my dear Sawyer as an example, so I'll use him, too. I think that's he's changed so much. At first, he was a complete and total lovable idiot who had no care for anyone but himself. He changed enough to call Jack, practically an enemy, his friend! He used to taunt Hurley all the time in perfectly hilarious scenes, and then genuinely threatened to kill anyone who harmed him. He started out using Kate for merely the physical aspect of the relationship, but he had nothing sexual to gain from holding her when she was crying in the hatch, or jumping from the helicopter to make sure she left safely (although that could be interpreted by some as a selfish action to keep him on the island).
I'm just learning about Miles, and I'm not a huge fan. I am, however, a major fan of Daniel. I was in band yesterday, and the substitute teacher looked like a more different version of him. Later I asked my sister who the man looked like in LOST, and she immediately answered, "Daniel Faraday".
Hmmm. I'd actually never thought about the Oceanic 6's return to normal life like that. Now that I have thought about it, they're all horrible people. Just kidding, just kidding. I think they want to help their friends, but that they're so terrified of returning to a place where so much bad happened. Kate's response to Jack suggestion to return shocked me a bit. She was so vehemently opposed to going back that I knew something
besides morals and selfishness was causing her to act like that. I think the Island weakened them and traumatized them, and I know I'd have to be convinced to go back to a place like that when I was finally safe at home. That's just my take on it.
I feel so behind in my LOST watching! I have to see about 10 more episodes before I'm caught up. I've gotta hurry before Season 6 gets here!
None of my RL friends are Losties like you all, and it's so good to be able to talk about LOST like this.  _________________
i'm back for a little! i'll see how this visit goes.
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Post subject: Posted: January 20th, 2010, 8:54 pm |
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Post subject: Posted: January 20th, 2010, 10:03 pm |
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Oh, I wasn't saying the the Island did a quick change-up on their characters. I meant that what they went through on the Island changed them. Hey, the Island has a personality of its own, so maybe that was its plan all along. The black smoke knows all, sees all....dun dun dunnnnn.
I completely agree with you. I wasn't trying to justify what the Oceanic 6 did, but I do think there are several reasons that played into their decision to "forget" about their friends. I think that whole not telling anyone back home thing came from Locke, right? Or was it Ben that started it? I think that it was the only thing they could have done in that situation to protect the Island and their friends, but they should have at least tried to come up with a way to save those still on the Island.
Ah, poor Sawyer. I'm not sure what Kate would have done if Sawyer came back with her. The triangle would just keep going on and on and on.... I think he wanted to save his friends and get them to safety, but he also wasn't ready to face what was back home. He didn't smile with joy as he jumped, though, so I know his motives weren't entirely for himself. Mostly, maybe, but not entirely. His line "I wanted to make sure she....they...got to the boat" (or something like that) convinces me that he did have their rescue in mind. _________________
i'm back for a little! i'll see how this visit goes.
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Post subject: Posted: January 21st, 2010, 12:20 pm |
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Post subject: Posted: January 21st, 2010, 6:14 pm |
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I thought it was heartbreaking when Jack read Locke's suicide-but-turned-into-more-of-a-murder letter!  He was just so devastated that he messed things up again. I felt quite sorry for him. I think Jack should just listen to Locke because Locke's got his thing going on with the Island, and has a much better chance of knowing what's really going on. I agree; I would really like to seem them show some kind of regret for abandoning their fellow Losties for so long.
Quote: I do wonder if he considered life off the island without her was worse than staying on the island.
Oh, I definitely think he thought that! I find that hopelessly romantic. Speaking of romantic, I just officially experienced Suliet in context with the rest of the show. (When I decided to start watching LOST last year, I came in on LaFleur.) I think I fell in love. There are several things stopping me from supporting them 100%, though. Even though Sawyer was ridiculously happy and Juliet, my favorite female character, was so perfect for him....I can't just forget about Skate. It was so sudden and expected me to throw away my favorite Skate memories from seasons 1 and 2, and I can't do that right now. I'm quite torn.
I don't think I've seen any trailer yet. I haven't been looking, though, so that might be part of the problem. lol
************SEASON SIX SPOILERS RESPONSE************
Michael will be back??? Darn it. I thought he was gone for good. Bla. I've always loved Libby, and I'm very happy to hear we'll learn more about her. Yay!
haha I guess we'll have to see the season premiere a few times to understand it, too. And how in the world will that work? That's basically erasing everything that happened in the last 3 seasons. That's kind of a downer. It's probably the studio's attempt to bring in the viewers that didn't feel like watching all of the show. _________________
i'm back for a little! i'll see how this visit goes.
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