To me the picture of love that Tolkien draws in the sacrifice and loyalty of many of his characters is breathtaking and has often moved me to tears. It is even more so as he contrasts it against dark evil and treachery. What wonderful glimpses of this eternal principle we are privy to as the inhabitants of ME struggle with the tumult in their world and lives.

I would just like to hear your thoughts on how your favorite characters in LotR relate to this great ebb and flow of love and how it has changed your understanding and your lives.

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"If you do not find a way, no one will."

*applauds Aerlinn* Nice job of summing all of it up.

You know, I find it very ironic that a lot of people call LOTR "dark" - yet there's so much love in it. The backbone of the story is what people do for love - of their country, friends, romantic interest, etc.

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Thanks RA, Elenriel, PD/Aliana Dawn, Arwen, Aramel, Shadowcat, Nurr, Tar-Dis!
Pippin of Herenya's Line - "...give nothing back!"
Got fed up and eloped with Ragetti 1-3-08
PHYLLIS, THE ANTI-SUSPIAN!

I think that Tolkien communicated something else as well...

Look at the story of Beren and Luthien, compared to the story of Aredhel and Eol. It said that Beren was filled with love for Luthien, but Eol was filled with desire. Apparently, the relationships based on love work out, but not the one based on lust.

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~Follower of Christ~

~Extreme Evanescent~

~Claimed Elladan July 03, 2007~ :3

In its most basic form, love is a circle. It truly is what makes the world go round. Love is other centered. It esteems the other person more than ones self. It gives freely to the beloved and the beloved returns in like, completing the cycle.

It works beautifully until the circle is broken by selfishness. If I refuse to participate in this othercenteredness, I go linear and fly out of the circle which leads to issolation and eventually death. This is why Tolkien's great principle of evil destroying itself is so true. A lake with no outlet becomes stagnant and dead. Life is intimately entwined with the great principle of love. This is why God, the life-giver, is so often defined by love.

Miriel, you made a great comment about lust. When you really look at the essence of love, how can a relationship based on lust (or selfish desire) endure? Often we mistake one for the other because they can feel so close but truly they are opposites.

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"If you do not find a way, no one will."

Tolkien knew the sacrifices of love.his mother lived in poverty because of her choices and his own wife had to sacrifice her family to marry him.

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proud to be a pipe smoker like JJRT

You know, Sinbearer, the problem with posting after you is that by the time you're through, there's not much left to say. Your ability to state your opinions clearly, concisely, and simply leave me amazed every time.

As you said, love is about putting others before yourself. In the case of the prominent Tolkien couples, it was about putting others even before the Other in your life. For Eärendil, it was about putting his people, both Humans and Elves, before even Elwing and his love and anxiety for her.

It seems to me that Tolkien really portrays that clearly, how the essence of love requires putting the lives you don't know or care about so personally before the life of those that you do know and love deeply. It is evident throughout his writings, and though it hasn't left me in tears yet, it's left me pretty close to them sometimes.

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The Struggles that the Fellowship face moves me. The bravery shown in the face of death in the defence for friends is amazing and it has really changed my life.
I feel for the characters.
Tolkien was a genious.

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Wow! Such a great point that I haven’t thought about much! That is something that often gets passed over in our obsession with love stories. To give oneself only for your loved ones is so moving and heroic but look into the heart of a dying soldier who is giving his life for his country. . He is giving up all he holds dearest and breaking the hearts of those he loves closest and best for people he will never know. His last full measure is for both the grateful and the careless. Like you said, his sacrifice encompasses far more than we usually really contemplate.

But it is never in vain. Nothing is lost in this world. Every gift, however small or unnoticed, comes back one hundred fold. The cycles of life testify to it. The truth is too compelling and powerful to be hidden. Plant a seed and watch the result. How can it be any different if the gift is your life? Such a gift contemplates the extreme of this principle. It also must complete the circle of life—the circle of love—and cannot be lost or die. The very essence of the act attests to its immortality. Other-centeredness brings life. Self-centeredness spawns death. That is what is so hopeful to me about these seeming tragedies.

These ideas are so powerfully illustrated in LotR. No wonder Tolkien’s saga was the second most read book next to the Christian bible in the 20th century!



The sacrifice for friend and nation is so compelling isn’t it! . I think it goes even deeper than this though. It cuts to the objective nature of truth in our hearts—the contrast of darkness against light. A great example of this is what happens with young boys and tales of knights and dragons. These stories give the most effective challenge a young boy could be given. It throws down the question, “How will you live your life?” It exclaims, “There is real evil and there is transcendent good—would you risk your life for good—for all that is noble, pure and honorable?” It gives him a thrilling glimpse of light.

Other centeredness is at the root of our sacrifice but it goes beyond our love for family, friend and nation. I think it embraces also our love for God and who He is—and consequently doing what is noble, pure and honorable because we love Him more than life.

This is one of the greatest lessons we learn from Tolkien and what lifts Lord of the Rings above the run of fantasy tales, and gives it its epic greatness.

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"If you do not find a way, no one will."