_________________




^ By me and my SS *squiggle hugs*

...so does anyone have any idea what mark Jack left on Bubket?

_________________




^ By me and my SS *squiggle hugs*

Someone asked one of the writers that and he replied "It's Chinatown Jake." Which is an incorrect quote from the movie Chinatown and it basically means you're not meant to know or understand what mark Jack left on Beckett just take it as it is.

_________________
"There's an ocean between.....where I am and where I want to be"

Oh, well thats annoying isn't it?

*reads above post*

*dies*

Bubket... omg...

Whoa, I am behind now... Let me see if I can catch back up...(starts to write post half an hour latter) Okay...

Pirateoftherings, Thank you for the writter quote to answer our question. Personaly it doesn't bother too terribley much that they did not tell what mark Jack left on Beckett...it leaves room for fanfiction lol...but it would have been cool to know. (shrugs)

BanannaRepublic, Thanks for sharing those pictures with us. You have got some really cool stuff. I especaily love the Jack shirt. lol I am glad that you were able to buy it.

JF, Thanks for sharing those pictures of Pirates of the Caribbean merchandise with us.

ErulisseEnethnin, Welcome to the Pirates of the Caribbean discussion once again. I could not agree with you more about Elizabeth becomming a pirate! They had hinted so strongley towards that in the previous Pirates of the Caribbean films that had they not had done that I would have been extremly dissappointed. At the start of Curse of the Black Peal it was shown that Elizabeth was raised to be a "laddie"...what was thought of as a lady in those days at least (no running around, giving orders, chossing a husband based on his place in the society, ect ect.). However as it went on we where shown that deep down Elizabeth was not that kind of woman. She was a woman who believed in taking charge of her life, marrying the man who she loved (even if he was a blacksmith/or pirate), and doing Whatever it took to get what she wanted. Now I have not always been a fan of Elizabeth's and still have major issues with the character's actions that hinge me from truely saying that I am a fan of hers (even after At World's End) but I must say that the character is indeed a strong character in some ways.
Also I am Very impressed with your explanation for debate/disscussion. (claps) However at some point the discussion does have to come to an end, once all points have been made, with the parties usaly just agreeing to disagree. Personaly speaking I love a good, clean round of debate. Having said that...I found Norrington to be a very interresting character. He had so many different layers to him. On the top he was a navy man or who JF said learned to hide his feelings in most situations, on the next layer he had a heart that yearned (for Elizabeth to love him, his navy poisition back, his life back, and revenge upon all (except Elizabeth) who had harmed him), and on the last layer he was sweet, kind, to some extent understanding perhaps, and was torn between what he believed to be right and good. Plus I think that it was always great fun to try to guess what he was going to do next. To try to guess whether or not he would side with our group of pirates and near pirates or the navy life which he had grown to love, which side of him was going to win out so to speak.
I did not love Norrington because he wanted someone who did not want him. I loved him because he loved Elizabeth enough to let her go. Some men would have kept after her and perhaps even became dangerous. However Norrington grasciously let Elizabeth go and be with the man who she had left him for. I would have been allright with him being mad at Elizabeth and even if had had an anger fueled disscussion with her. However I was pleased that he was man enough to not harm her physicaly (not even by means of words). To me that is what a real man should do (if she does not want him, he should leave her be) and I enjoy seeing that type of man portrayed in movies. Then Jack Davenport's preformance just added to the wonderful character of Norrington. Just my opinion though. I can see how some view him as bland though. He is not the first character by any means to have this sort of storyline. So I do see where you are coming from.

_________________
Destiny I'm a Christian boycrazy girl. Will Turner's wife ^&? Avatar by JF, banners by Taurquende, Nurrantiel Mashiara, Silme Meleth TarNymphadora, and JF taught me how to use banners. Thanks to all!

Was the last bit a response to what I said or my matching avatar and signiture ?

_________________
"There's an ocean between.....where I am and where I want to be"

Eru - Well, you can still hear a trace of your accent from...Sweden? Is that where you are originally from? I know you are in Iceland right now... And I totally forgot about the Jack/Barbossa spyglass scenes! OMG! Those were THE BEST! *dies*

*will not enter into the Norington debate*

I don't have a strong opinion about him either way, so I'll just stay quiet

_________________

<center>icon & banner by me
skyward-thoughts</center>

_________________


Ringer for Christ

_________________




^ By me and my SS *squiggle hugs*

Well, I haven't been on this thread for a while, so, naturally, there's a lot to catch up on. When I re-read my last post, I found it rather incomprehensible, but here's where I was getting at.

Packed can be a good thing. (LOTR was packed). But it depends if it's packed with stuff you want to see and if all that stuff makes sense.

1. I believe what made CotBP so popular was Jack's Sparrow's wit and charm. In AWE he had no "wittiness" (in AWE, some mild humour about spyglasses was about as far as we got - not saying that wasn't funny, but compared to the humour in CotBP [which actually involved some wit] it didn't amount to anything) and I don't know about you, but betraying your friends, for really no purpose (that I could see, at least) doesn't strike me as charming.
In AWE we got a lot of big, noisy battles, that were filled with special effects, but really, very empty. Ask yourself this, which battle/sword fight did you enjoy better; the highly involved and very pleasing to the eye battle on the Flying Dutchman in AWE, or the simple battle in the black-smith's shop in CotBP? For me, the CotBP one was much better.

2. I really don't think that AWE plot made sense at all. And there was no time to figure it out. You'd be confused with on scene, try to figure that scene out, but while you're doing that, another confusing scene will be shot at you.
I went ot see AWE with 6 other people. Out of the 7 of us, only 1 person understood what was going on; me! And I was the only one who had read spoilers. My sister, had a better idea of what was happening then my friends, (she didn't fully get it either) but she had spent time going over DMC and CotBP to try to guess what would happen in AWE.
Even in A-U you can see this. We've all seen the same movie, but we're arguing over the ending. So, even the ending is unclear!

Here's an article that explains what I'm trying to say here.
http://www.ew.com/ew/article/0,,20041109,00.html
(I hope no one gets offended with this. Remember that the article is addressing the people on the EW forum, not the A-U one!)





The characters were the same if you mean that their names were the same and they were played by the same actors, but their personalities became almost unreconizable by the end of AWE.

In CotBP, Elizabeth, started out as a strong governor's daughter who hated pirates and only worked with them in order to help Will and to be with him. In DMC, she was, well, I found no really personality to her. I found her very whinney ("This is barbaric! This is no way for grown men to settle - !Oh! Fine! Let's just - pull out our swords and start banging away at each other! This will solve everything!"). In AWE, she evolved into a strong Pirate King (so much for the "I've had enough with wobbly-legged, rum-soaked pirates!") who makes wonderful uplifting speeches.

Will changed very lttle from CotBP to DMC. In AWE, however, he became a full pirate by betraying his friends.

Jack, who was a very witty, and charming pirate in CotBP, (and made such smart remakes. "Unless, of course, he knew you wouldn't believe the truth if he told it to you.") was reduced to a man running aroung, screaming, and falling down, in DMC. In AWE, he betrayed everyone, and, finnaly, made a good choice.

Many of these character developments could be acceptable, except for the fact that the changes happened in a matter of minutes.

Overall, I think AWE was a mess, and a sad way to end the Pirates trilogy.

Oh we should make a club for it! I agree, I will never ever ever be happy not in a million years over Norrie's un-needed death. Yes it gave it more drama, but I'm mad! (I guess they couldn't figure out what they were going to do with him....but he could have gone back to Port Royal! *shakes fist*) Eh, I made up another ending too, but when I saw the movie I thought the end was alright. (I think I know what your ending is.....and I like it, it's a good idea).

_________________


Ringer for Christ

I think AWE was full of plot holes but then you have to understand that the writers had to write two movies in less than a year. I believe I read some where that they originally tried to get COTBP off the ground 10 years prior to showing it to Disney, so they had time to really work on it. The action sequences and characters are what keeps AWE afloat.

And it seemed to me that all of the betraying that was going on, wasn't them actually betraying each other. For the most part they were playing Beckett for a fool and leading him straight into a trap.

_________________
"There's an ocean between.....where I am and where I want to be"

^I find it really hard to give the writters a break. If they couldn't get a good story out in the certain time frame, why didn't they wait? They seemed to just throw everything together and hope that the people who loved CotBP would get sucked into seeing the next 2. And that's what happened. If an AWE-type movie had been the first in the series, I don't think Pirates would have done very well at all.

TheThain, Thank you very much for posting that artical. I enjoyed reding it. However I highly disagree with the author's point of view. I and my family over all did not find it confusing at all. Even my father who says that he "just watches the movie" understood it. There were bits that you had to take a few seconds to contemplate, you had to try to figure out which deals to betray the other(s) were truely to betray the others (aka one to none) and which ones had been planned but nothing that really interrupted the storyline. I saw it as pretty straight forward. (shrugs)

Elven Archer, Welcome to the Pirates of the Caribbean At world's end thread. I am glad that you enjoyed the movie. I am disappointed that Norrington died too. He was a wonderful character.

_________________
Destiny I'm a Christian boycrazy girl. Will Turner's wife ^&? Avatar by JF, banners by Taurquende, Nurrantiel Mashiara, Silme Meleth TarNymphadora, and JF taught me how to use banners. Thanks to all!

So you didn't get offended! *sigh of relief* I was afraid of posting it because some of the "The other half of you are adamant, to the point of righteousness, about how utterly logical and easy to follow At World's End is, assuming that you have a brain" comments. Really, I don't get that feeling from any of you!:)



Okay, that being said, do you agree with the author that "At World's End is that it's a massive collection of loose ends — plot points that are introduced and not quite followed through"? I think discussing whether or not AWE was confusing can get kind of pointless. Afterall, if you found it straightforward, I don't really think I'll be able to convince you that it was confusing!